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Dan Bohi and The River Movement

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on July 31, 2012

Dan Bohi and the River

Keep in mind while you read this article if you don’t buy into what Dan and others are selling your church will be referred to as a dead church because just studying Gods Word and sharing the Gospel of Jesus Christ doesn’t seem to be enough these days. Christians are needing experiences and experience based worship.

From Kevins Reeves book ” The Other Side Of The River” (Please buy this book from Lighthouse Trails)

The River Movement is an offshoot of the Latter Rain revival, which began in Saskatchewan, Canada in the 1940s, Many other movements sprouted from the Latter Rain. Follower believe that the Rain revival is the latter rain referred to in the such scriptures as Jerimiah 3:3,Joel 2:23, and Hosea 6:3.The Manifest Sons of God is an extremist group that was birthed from what became known as the Latter Day Rain Movement referenced above. In February of 1948 in North Battleford, Saskatchewan, a community of believers met to seek God for His power. A power did manifest. Miracles were reported, and Christians from all over set out on a pilgrimage to get this power. The Latter Day Rain movement emerged full blown, evidencing supposed signs and wonders,prophetic utterances, and impartations via the laying on of hands. The movement  was also marked with a spirit of elitism, false prophecies, and an inbred authority structure based upon the new “word of the Lord.”When the Christian community was faced with the decision between solid biblical teaching and awe inspiring miracles, many swung their legs over the fence of indecision and jumped with both feet into one of the first major 20th century tributaries of the River.

From Kevin Reeves book “The Other Side of the River” ” A current river is flowing, which many believe to be of God. Removed from its proper setting in the 47th chapter of Ezekiel, which speaks of a stream gushing out from the Temple of God, this passage in Scripture is today used to promote a last days vision for the church. In its proper context in Ezekiel, this wonderful prophecy is an encouragement that God has not forgotten His covenant people of Israel.But overstepping the sanctity of scriptural boundaries, this passage has been reshaped into the comfortable doctrines of the easy believism and sensual manifestations that mark a massive shift in the church. As believers, we have taken a hairpin turn that from the preeminence of the Word of God to a relative, expereintial, and terribly apostate faith.” end of quote

 Also in scripture Jesus uses living water to simply describe salvation and eternal life in John 3:4 and John

4:10.

Its hard to pin down Dan since he very carefully dances around the edge of all these false doctrines such as Rodney Howard Brownes false teachings in Dans own tape Take Another drink on U Tube which at best shows Dans very carnal teaching.

We need to remember the scriptures speaks of this times as “perilous times” (2 Timothy 3:1) and I often wonder why my Nazarene brother and sister who in their very own history rejected Pentecostalism after Azuza street broke out.

(From Wiki)

“The term “Pentecostal” in the church’s original name soon proved to be problematic. In the Wesleyan-holiness movement, the word was used widely as a synonym simply for “holiness.” But the rise of 20th century Pentecostalism, especially after 1906, gave new meanings and associations to the term — meanings that the Pentecostal Nazarene rejected. In 1919, the name was shortened to avoid any confusion in the public mind about the church’s place on the theological spectrum.”

 

Only to embrace Dan Bohi and his odd mixture of Word Faith/Latter Day Rain/Signs and Wonders teachings.

Also what is increasingly odd is to see how many of my friends will reject the experience based teachings of the Emergent Church but embrace the experience and emotionally charged meetings Dan Bohi serves up?

 

Im sure many of the folks who attend Dans meetings are fine people of God who truly desire serving the Lord and want to fight the good fight of faith.

But to quote Kevins book once more and to end this article.

 

“Why do people ignore warning signs? Its like a motorist painting over his oil pressure gauge so he wont notice the depleting measure. But the reality of the situation will become evident enough when his engine seizes up, and the car comes to a sudden halt. I’ve discovered in the spiritual arena most people will do exactly this: they take pains to look the other way when something bumps up against their doctrine. As a Christian there’s no quicker way to start a fight with a friend than to tell him that some of his most fervent beliefs are wrong. I know Iv’e’ lost my share of friendships that way. The problem comes with the uncomfortable. And the horror of it is that in spiritual matters were dealing with eternal things. While the person who ruins his vehicle can at least purchase another, the human soul is irreplaceable.

End quote

And double dittos for me

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Dan Bohi and hi…

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on May 21, 2012

Dan Bohi and his false teachings:
I would suggest for this that everyone be faithful Bereans and search the scripture and balance it against what Dan is teaching.The problem with the Emergent Church coming in to the Nazarene denomination is that it was already here for sometime but no one bothered to search the scriptures to see if what was being said and taught was true. Hope we learned from that.
With Dan I would suggest you start at this link on U Tube titled the two Wings of the Dove.
http://youtu.be/5YqqX7MtP68
Then go to “Take Another Drink” on U Tube by Bohi. Dan promotes being drunk in the spirit at the end on 8 and 9 in this series.
Then go to” Faith not maybe I am”
I encourage you to watch all 9 parts of each one of the series they are only about 7-8 minutes apiece.
I could barely make it through the very first 2 of “Take another drink” but I will let you decide.
Within this series Dan states a boy was healed of MS as well as a lady who only had three weeks to live from cancer. I would like to see documented proof of these healings and will be contacting Dan so he can provide proof.
Dan is typical of many preachers on TBN who state we can stop God by our lack of faith,sin,fear or ignorance. This is a tactic used by faith healers to explain why people dont get healed.This is more of having faith in your own faith. Dan also states he does not like the scriptural definition of faith stated in Heb 11 and then goes on to give his own definition. Dan states this i the series Faith not maybe I AM 1/9. Dan very cleverly mixes truth with error. Dan then promotes false teacher Bill Johnson in 4/12 of Faith Not maybe I am. For more on Bill Johnson go to this article http://notunlikelee.wordpress.com/2012/03/11/bill-johnsons-christology-a-new-age-christ/ Bill Johnson has claimed that angel feathers and gold dust have appeared in his church just google him for more information.
Dan Bohi also distorts what scripture teaches about people seeking signs and wonders in his series “Take Another Drink” 3/9. Dan also states a lot about revelation knowledge and that he pretty much operates in all the gifts of the Spirit in the link I provided.Revelation Knowledge is God speaking to you personall outside of you reading Hid written Word. For more about Revelation Knowledge check here and listen to the podcast.
http://www.echozoe.com/archives/2494
Dan Bohi has also made claims that a lot of tithers are being taken but people are not getting saved. Where do we get those numbers at? Dan just kinda throws that out there. Dan claims at one of his meetings that 200 people were filled with the Spirit and 75 people were saved. You receive the Holy Spirit at salvation so Im not sure what that is about. Sanctification is a process I know but you are filled with the Holy Spirit at the moment of your salvation. That where you start to be less so He can become more. I will continue to go into Dan in more detail in future articles. I do want to thank my brother and friend in the Lord Sandy Simpson (who was on our DVD) for publishing my article on Dan on his website Deception in the Church. His site gets over 1 million hits a month so we will continue to get the word out.
But dont take my word on it. Listen to Dans series and then hold it up to the light of scripture. Keep in mind sucess and large altar calls mean nothing. Look at Benny Hinn,the Toronto Blessing Todd Bently etc.. And Dan is very much cut from the same carpet. So view the teaching read your Bibles and decide for yourself. Dan Bohi is very clever at mixing truth with deadly error and is also man centered in his teaching and preaching. PS The Holy Spirit never lost one of His wings and it is surely not up to us to allow God to work in power and glory for His great pleasure.

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Justin Peters expose the Word Faith Movement

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on August 3, 2011

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What Do Emergents Believe? By Manny Silva

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on May 28, 2010

Great Article by my friend and brother in the Lord Manny Silva

What Do Emergents Believe? A Review

Recently a pastor friend of mine asked me the following, and I thought it would be good chance to give folks a short summary on the main characteristics or beliefs of an emergent thinker.

“How can someone know with 100% certainty that he/she is an emergent pastor? Is it a formal set of thoughts, or beliefs that make you one? Or just because he/she doesn’t condemn something, does it mean that he/she condones it?”

Let me answer the last question first: “Or just because he/she doesn’t condemn something, does it mean that he/she condones it?” No, not at all. And I would never ask that anyone condemn any movement, unless they themselves have come to the clear conclusion that I have, that it is a movement not of God, because of its basic ideology that is contrary to scripture. Some people still cannot yet condemn it outright, because they just don’t know much about it, or only a little bit. To those who have come to that conclusion, I am asking them to speak out against it, if they believe that these emergent practices contradict scripture and are threatening the salvation of our youth and others.

“How can someone know with 100% certainty that he/she is an emergent pastor? Is it a formal set of thoughts, or beliefs that make you one?” The ones that I know for sure are emergent, and and there are plenty that I have actually spent time talking with, going back and forth with them on the NazNet forum, or my own blog, hold certain values or belief systems, which they themselves articulate to me. Not all share the exact same things, but in general, there are some things that they do.
I don’t think there is a formal, official setting down of emergent ideology which anyone can grab onto and read. I don’t know of a specific universally acknowledged “handbook” for emergent ideology and doctrine. The ambiguity within the movement is one of the things they like- to keep it a moving target, so they cannot be pinned down completely, especially on doctrine. That’s why they tend to play down biblical doctrine, for to articulate their beliefs in a very clear way would not be advantageous for them. Brian McLaren is generally considered the “godfather” of the emergent movement.

In my two years of research, here are some of their attitudes and beliefs I have found that they have in common:

1. THE BIBLE IS NOT GOD’S FULLY INSPIRED WORD. This is the underlying and most critical and dangerous foundation of emergent thought today, in my opinion. A belief that the Bible “contains” God’s word, but is not necessarily God’s word in total. This has opened it up for people like Karl Giberson of ENC with his evolution teaching and rejection of biblical inerrancy, Tom Oord of NNU with his Open Theism teaching (God does not know the future), and Dennis Bratcher’s Process Theology (God learns from His mistakes). These false teachings have led many emergents to accept, or at least hold to the possibility, that Adam perhaps was just a fable, and not a real person, or that there was not a worldwide flood, as the Bible says there was, or perhaps that Methuselah did not really live for 967 years, or that Jonah was not swallowed up by a large fish, and on and on. (Instead, read Psalm 119 and learn about the power and authority of God’s word; God’s word is truth (John 17:17); it is eternal’, and his commands are trustworthy, His laws are right, giving light and understanding; directing our footsteps, makes us wiser than our enemies, makes us blessed, strengthens us, sustains us. Jesus said not even the smallest part of scripture can be broken. Hebrews 5:12 calls the written record the oracles of God. Paul said that his words were the word of God (1 Thess. 2:13; 1 Cor. 4:1; 2 Cor. 5:20. And finally, Revelations says in 22:18-19 that it is important not to add or subtract from the words of this prophesy (Revelation). GOD’S WORD IS TRUTH!

2. THE BIBLE IS A MYSTERY. Popularized and expounded on often by Brian McLaren, Rob Bell, and others. It is a fascination with the Bible as something that cannot be truly understood, because it is wrapped in mystery that is far too complex for Christians to ever know something with certainty. (This is the attempt to make all things relative, and to deny the authority, clarity, and infallibility of scripture, which I believe is at the core of the ideology of this movement. Deny the clarity and infallibility of scripture, which lays the foundation for anything goes, and puts up a wall of “non-judgmentalism” for those who deny scripture’s reliability. There are no absolutes, yet at the same time, they are saying that there is one absolute: “there are no absolutes!” You will often see this uncertainty placed on even the most obvious passages of scripture, and they will insist that you are using your own “personal interpretation.” For folks who insist the Bible is “mysterious to the core”, as Rob Bell puts it, they sure are certain of themselves. How ironic!

3. EMBRACING OF ANCIENT RITUALS, PAGAN PRACTICES, AND MYSTICS. Emergents have a love for bringing in ancient Roman Catholic practices and pagan rituals; use of candles, icons, and other “props” to help us get closer to God; prayer labyrinths, lectio divina, prayer stations, and such. They also embrace the writings of such obvious heretics as Henri Nouwen and Thomas Merton, both Catholic mystics who embraced universalism and other religions. This is a core part of emergent ideology, and emergents will either defend it completely, or they will dance around the questions and refuse to condemn these pagan practices or their love for these mystics and their writings. In a previous post, I stated that concerned Christians will be totally upfront about what they believe, and what they clearly condemn as unbiblical; not so with emergents. They tend to dance around the questions, and will not clearly state that, for instance, a prayer labyrinth has no business whatsoever in a Christian church, because it is unbiblical. These practices all are an attack on the sufficiency of scripture for Christians; instead, nothing else is needed. The Bible is all we need to live our Christian life, and there is no need to use these things to enhance it. That is an insult to the sufficiency of simply placing our faith in Christ and His death on the cross.

4. POST-MODERN/CULTURAL ACCOMMODATION. Emergents are fascinated with the idea that we need to adjust the Bible to the culture in a post-modern world. Instead of focusing on the unchanging truth of the gospel and how it has done its job through the Holy Spirit, for over 2,000 years, they are obsessed with “community”, and “missional”, and all sorts of other phrases which emphasize the attempt to “become relevant” to the post-modern culture. Trust me, missional no longer means what it used to mean. Those of us who oppose this ideology say to them, the Bible is always and will ever be relevant to he culture; we should not compromise it, and we should not doubt that the gospel “once given to the saints”, will do its work through the Holy Spirit, in this culture, or other cultures to come. Besides, does anyone think that post-modernism will last forever? When the next fad culture comes along, what do we do then? Change again? Their basic stance is this, which Brian McLaren holds to: in 2,000 years, we have got it all wrong, and we need to start all over again. Thus, his book and it’s title, “A New Christianity”, says it all. But scripture says: “For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.” Romans 1:16

5. SOCIAL GOSPEL/SOCIAL JUSTICE. An unhealthy fascination with the social gospel, or with social justice, and environmental concerns, and a Kingdom of God on earth mentality, that we ourselves can right all the evils and wrongs of the world if we work together with anyone, and any religion. I believe in helping the poor, the downtrodden, etc., but too many times emergents de-emphasize the primary goal (preaching the gospel to the unsaved) at the expense of cleaning the sidewalks of the neighborhoods, without ever reaching any unsaved with the message. We are ignoring the fact that the real Kingdom of God will not be finally established until Christ returns in His glory, to judge the world.

6. DOWNPLAYING OF DOCTRINE. A downplaying of biblical doctrine, including but not limited to the following: the importance of right doctrine; the coming judgment of the world and Christ’s return; the existence and reality of a literal hell; the denial that there will be eternal punishment for those who reject Christ; separation from the world while being in the world. yet over and over, scripture emphasizes the importance of right doctrine (1 Tim 4:16; 2 Tim. 4:1-5; Acts 20:28-31; Jude 1:3)

7. SYNCRETISM OR BLENDING WITH OTHER RELIGIONS. Many also seem to show a very close affinity to a universalistic view of salvation, such as McLaren and others, who either don’t answer the question, or who say that probably Hindus and Buddhists will make it to heaven, even if they have not repented and accepted Christ. I have seen this kind of thinking even on the NazNet forum, which is an unofficial Nazarene discussion website. not all emergents think like this, but many do, and this is a dangerous move towards acceptance of universalism and relativism right in the evangelical church today.
(John 14:6)

8. DISTORTION OR REJECTION OF JUDGING. Emergents will over and over again emphasize love and friendship, and will reject judgmentalism, as if you can only have one or the other. Remember when Paul rebuked Peter publicly for a seemingly minor problem, and in public? I do believe Paul did that out of love, and as well as his criticism and rebuke of various churches that he wrote to. Paul loved these folks, and it was out of love for them that he exposed their errors so that they could then turn from those errors, and follow right doctrine. Do not ever let anyone tell you that you as an individual Christian cannot judge a set of beliefs or someone’s doctrine or practice. That is called discernment, and without it, we cannot do they work of defending the true faith. Emergents reject this because if they accepted it, it would more clearly expose their false teachings and bring them to the light. (For a solid teaching on judging, see Yomi’s lesson Judge Not? on my blog), as well as this post, Is It Right?, on Tim Wirth’s blog.

So this is a short description of some things to watch out for if you wonder whether a pastor or other Christian may be emergent. Keep in mind that they will not generally shout it out, but instead will hide their ideology as much as possible and are very subtle in their teaching. You must be grounded in the word of God, or you could be deceived by fine sounding language and arguments.
“See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ.” Col. 2:8

“Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.” 1 John 4:1
May the Lord help us all to stay true to the gospel “once for all entrusted to the saints”. May He give us the courage to help and witness to someone who may be falling captive to these false doctrines. It is our responsibility as faithful Christians, to follow the whole counsel of God.

Manny

Manny Silva,
Stand For Truth Ministries

“The entirety of Your word is truth, And every one of Your righteous judgments endures forever.” Psalm 119:160

A soma da tua palavra é a verdade, e cada uma das tuas justas ordenanças dura para sempre.

“We are hard pressed on every side, but not crushed; perplexed, but not in despair; persecuted, but not abandoned; struck down, but not destroyed.” 2 Corinthians 4:8-9

Em tudo somos atribulados, mas não angustiados; perplexos, mas não desesperados;perseguidos, mas não desamparados; abatidos, mas não destruídos;

Blogging at http://www.reformednazarene.wordpress.com
FaceBook group: Concerned Nazarenes

Posted in Alan Roxburgh, Allelon, Bob Hunter, Brian McLaren, Charles Christian, Dan Boone, David Pettigrew, Dennis Bratcher, Emergent Church, Emergent church within the Nazarene denomination, Gene Schandorff, Jesse Middendorf, John Hanna, Jon Middendorf, Leonard Sweet, Naz Net, New spirituality, Rick Warren, Rob Bell, Scott Daniels, Shea Zellweger, Tom Oord, Uncategorized | Leave a Comment »

Church of the Nazarene’s Creation Care document

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on May 15, 2010

Subject: Church of the Nazarene’s Creation Care document

(I am sending this to several persons)

Hi all,

My wife and I moved from Virginia to Tennessee in the summer of 2006. We have attended the Church of the Nazarene for almost 2 1/2 years and been members for about 2 years. I first learned of the emerging church movement about 2 years ago from a friend in Virginia. Since then I have been paying attention to it, and in the last few months have been spending time almost every day researching and learning more than I want to know about it. I thank each of you for your courage and diligence in exposing this repackaged postmodern liberalism or perhaps a better way of saying it is “another gospel”, a false and deceptive gospel. The Church of the Nazarene desperately needs more who will “earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints”.

I have spent some time on the international website of the Church of the Nazarene digging about, and have already found several things that deeply concern me. A few months ago I came across something in the Compassionate Ministries section (http://www.ncm.org/awareness/environment/) called “the Church of the Nazarene’s official statement on creation care”, which is a 62 page PDF document entitled Creation Care – Environmental Stewardship for the Church of the Nazarene (http://www.ncm.org/pdf/creation_care_document.pdf). You may already be familiar with it, but if not I strongly recommend you take the time to read it. Many things in the document are very disturbing, but this statement on page 59 takes the cake: “In this most critical moment in Earth’s history, we are convinced that the central moral imperative of our time is the care for Earth as God’s creation.” I thought the central moral imperative of our time was to reach the lost for Christ and to make disciples of them.

I think this document needs to be brought to light before the faithful and Bible-believing members of the Church of the Nazarene. This article on Earth Day, radical environmentalism, and the worship of Gaia (Mother Earth), also needs to be read by many, as it too is very enlightening: http://www.worldviewweekend.com/worldview-times/article.php?articleid=6089

Again thanks to all for their hard work. In the process you make many enemies, but you also make new friends, better friends.

In Christ,
Mike Yonce

Posted in Alan Roxburgh, Allelon, Bob Hunter, Brian McLaren, Charles Christian, Dan Boone, David Pettigrew, Dennis Bratcher, Emergent Church, Emergent church within the Nazarene denomination, Gene Schandorff, Jesse Middendorf, John Hanna, Jon Middendorf, Leonard Sweet, Naz Net, New spirituality, Rick Warren, Rob Bell, Scott Daniels, Shea Zellweger, Tom Oord, Uncategorized | Leave a Comment »

Is It Right?

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on May 13, 2010

Many today believe that it is wrong to expose error and to name names. Liberals have always seemed to believe this, but in recent times it has been widely espoused by evangelicals and charismatics. Those who are faithful in exposing error according to the Bible are now being widely denounced, and are accused of being unloving and unkind. In this tract we intend to present the teaching of the Bible on this vital subject.

I. It Is Right To Practice Biblical Judgment
One of the most misused verses in the Bible is, “Judge not, that ye be not judged” (Matt. 7: 1). Every Scripture verse should be read in its context, if we are to properly understand the true meaning. In vs. 2-5 of this same chapter it is evident that v. 1 is referring to hypocritical judgment. A brother who has a beam in his own eye should not be judging the brother who may have a mote in his eye. The lesson is plain, you cannot judge another for his sin if you are guilty of the same sin.

Those who cling to “Judge not, that ye be not judged, ” to condemn those who expose error should read the entire chapter. Jesus said, “Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing… ” (v. 15). How can we know false prophets unless we judge them by the Word of God? If we know the false prophets, how can we fail to exam the sheep of these “ravening wolves?” All through the Bible we find proof that they should be identified and exposed.

“Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit, but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit” (vs. 16,17). Did the Lord mean that we could not judge the tree (person), by the fruit of their life and doctrine? Certainly not, for you cannot know without judging. All judgment should be on the basis of Bible teaching, not according to whims or prejudices.

“Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment ” (John 7:24). Here our Lord commands that we are to “judge righteous judgment, ” which is judgment based upon the Word of God. If judgment is made upon any other basis, other than the Word of God, it is a violation of Matt. 7: 1. Webster’s Dictionary says that a judge is “one who declares the law. ” The faithful Christian must discern or judge on the basis of God’s inspired law, the Bible.

A fornicator is described in I Cor. 5:1-13. Paul “judged” (v.3) the man even though he was absent, and he told the Church at Corinth that they were to “judge” (v. 12) those that were within. The Greek word for “judge” is the same here as in Matt. 7: 1. Paul did not violate “judge not, that ye be not judged, ” in judging the man, nor in instructing the Church to judge also. All of this judgment was according to the Word of God.

A person who is able to discern between good and evil, has at least one of the major marks of spiritual maturity. “But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil” (Heb. 5:14). W.E. Vine says of the meaning of discern, “a distinguishing, a clear discrimination, discerning, judging; is translated ‘discerning’ in I Cor. 12: 10 of discerning spirits, judging by evidence whether they are evil or of God. ” Strong also agrees that it means to judge.

Those who are unwilling or incapable of discerning or judging between good and evil are in this manner revealing either their disobedience or their immaturity.

II. It Is Right To Expose False Teachers
False teachers are free to spread their poisonous doctrines today because there is a conspiracy of silence among many Bible believers. Wolves in sheep’s clothing are thus enabled to ravage the flock, thereby destroying many.

John the Baptist called the Pharisees and Sadducees (the religious leaders of his day) “a generation of Vipers” (snakes) (Matt. 3:7). Today, he would be accused of being unloving, unkind, and unchristian.

Jesus said to the religious Pharisees, “O generation of vipers, how can ye, being evil, speak good things? for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh” (Matt. 12:34). To many evangelicals and some fundamentalists, this would be unacceptable language today, but it is biblical language and it came from the mouth of the Son of God.

Standing face to face with these false teachers, Jesus Christ the Son of God, called them “hypocrites”, “blind guides, ” “blind, ” “whited sepulchres, ” “serpents, ” and “ye generation of vipers” (Matt. 23:23-34). Yet, we are told today that we are to fellowship with men whose doctrines are just as unscriptural as those of the Pharisees. Some who say they are Bible believing Christians insist on working with Roman Catholics and other assorted heretics. Yet, according to many, we are not supposed to rebuke them for their compromise.

Near the beginning of His ministry, “Jesus went up to Jerusalem, And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables; And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence, make not my Father’s house an house of merchandise” (John 2:13-16). Our Saviour is presented today as one who was meek, lowly, kind, and loving, even to false teachers, but this is entirely false. When dealing with false teachers and prophets, His words were sharp and His actions plain.

Near the end of His public ministry, Christ found it necessary to cleanse the temple once again. The exposure of false doctrines and practices is a never ending job. At that time He said, “Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves” (Mark I 1: 17). Is it any different today? The thieves come into the house of God, and rob God’s people of the Bible and peddle their perverted Bibles instead. At the same time this den of thieves rob the people off the doctrine of separation and the doctrine of sanctification. Then you can hardly tell God’s people from the people of the world. In all honesty, should not these thieves (false teachers) be exposed?

In our day these false teachers have come into the churches with their books, music, literature, movies, psychology, and seminars, and have turned the Father’s house into a den of thieves. It is time that men of God stand up and expose their errors for all to see.

The Bible Admonishes Us To Expose Error
We are to TRY them. “Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits, whether they be of God; because many false prophets are gone out into the world” (I John 4: 1). All doctrine and teachers are to be tried according to the Word of God. “To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them” (Isa. 8:20). Every message, messenger, and method is to be judged according to the Word of God. The church at Ephesus was commended because they had “tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars ” (Rev. 2:2). The church at Pergamos was rebuked because they tolerated those that held “the doctrine of Balaam, ” and “the doctrine of the Nicolaitanes, which thing I hate” (Rev. 2:14,15). It is never right to tolerate false teachers, but they are to be tried by the Word of God, and exposed. Of course those who want to disobey the Word of God will seek by every means to avoid this teaching.

We are to MARK them and AVOID them. “Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them ” (Rom. 16:17). Those whose conduct and teaching contradicts the Word of God are to be marked and to be avoided. This requires discernment and judgment in the light of the Bible. The ecumenicalists, new evangelicals, and compromising fundamentalists will resist any effort to obey this Scripture. They cannot be marked and avoided, unless they are judged according to the Word of God.

We are to REBUKE them. “Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith ” (Titus 1: 13). This was written to Titus, because there were those going from house to house and subverting whole houses with false doctrine (v. 10-16). People like Rob Bell, Brian Mclaren, Len Sweet and others are subverting whole houses with their false doctrine today. Are we to sit silently by, while they do this, without rebuking and admonishing people to avoid their teaching? No, the faithful servant of the Lord is to be “Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers ” (Titus 1:9).

We are to have NO FELLOWSHIP with them. “And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them ” (Eph. 5:11). Reprove means to censure, condemn, find fault, rebuke, and to refute. How can we obey this Scripture unless we try them by the Word of God?

We are to WITHDRAW from them. “Now we command you, brethren, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which ye received of us ” (II Thess. 3:6). We are to withdraw from those whose doctrine and conduct does not conform to the Word of God.Biblical seperation among those even who are brothers in Christ is biblical and must be followed when the brother is promoting false teachers. The scripture is very plain about this. The context clearly shows that obedience to sound doctrine is what Paul has in mind, for he says, “if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. Yet, count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother” (II Thess. 3:14-15). Paul admonished Timothy to “withdraw thyself ” from those who “consent not to wholesome words … and to the doctrine which is according to godliness ” (I Tim. 6:3-5).

We are to TURN AWAY from them. Concerning the last days, he says that some will have “a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof. from such turn away” for such people are “never able to come to the knowledge of the truth” (11 Tim. 3:5,7). How can we turn away from them if we do not identify them, and this requires that their message be compared to the Word of God. It is the business of the true preacher to: “Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine ” (II Tim. 4:2). This is usually an unpopular and thankless task but it is the duty of the God-called man.

We are NOT to RECEIVE them into our house. “If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds ” (11 John 10, I 1). There is no doubt about who John is speaking about, it is ” Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ… ” (v.9). By radio, TV, music and literature, false prophets are brought into the homes of many Christians today. Brethren, this ought not to be!

We are to REJECT HERETICS. “A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject ” (Titus 3: 10). We should reject those who deny redemption by the blood of Christ. There are many who deny this or some other doctrine of the Word of God. If they will not respond to being admonished, then they are to be rejected.

We are to look out for those who preach another gospel. Paul warned about those who preached “another Jesus … another spirit … or another gospel” (II Cor. 11:4). How can we know them unless we judge their Jesus, their spirit, and their gospel by the Word of God? Paul called such preachers “false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ” (11 Cor. II: 13). He explains in v. 14-15 that these preachers are the ministers of Satan. The God-called man must be just as faithful today in exposing the ministers of Satan.

Paul warned the Galatians about those who “pervert the gospel of Christ.” He also said, “If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.” (See Gal. 1:6-9). Multitudes today are preaching a perverted gospel. Those who teach salvation by baptism, or by works, are teaching a perverted gospel. Those who preach a salvation that you can lose, are preaching a perverted gospel. The charismatics, Catholics, many evangelicals, and many fundamentalists (?) are preaching a perverted gospel. Yet, we are supposed to cooperate with them in evangelism and Christian work, according to many today. If we fail to expose these false prophets, then we have betrayed Christ and His gospel.

We are to SEPARATE from them. “Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch no the unclean thing; and I will receive you ” (II Cor. 6:17). This makes it plain. God’s people are to come out of apostasy and religious error. How can any Bible believer remain in the National Council or World Council of Churches? How can they remain among compromising evangelicals and wishy-washy fundamentalists?

III. It Is Right To Name Names
Many mistakenly believe that it is wrong to expose error and to name the guilty teachers; but they are wrong according to the Bible.

Paul named Peter publicly. Peter was guilty of unscriptural practice. “But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed … But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of the Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?” (Gal. 2:11-14). The whole issue revolved around salvation by the law or by grace. When the integrity and purity of the gospel is at stake, then we have no choice when it comes to the matter of exposing error and naming names.

Paul named Demas for loving the world. “For Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world” (II Tim. 4:10). Those who forsake the cause of Christ for worldly living and pleasures should be named and exposed.

Paul named Hymenaeus and Alexander. Paul told Timothy to “war a good warfare; Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some have put away concerning faith have made shipwreck: Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme ” (I Tim. 1: 18-20). God’s true servants should war a good warfare, and name those who have departed from the faith that was once delivered to the saints. Paul is not here discussing the faith of salvation but the faith as a system of doctrine. These men had made shipwreck of it and Paul exposed them and called their names.

Paul named Hymenaeus and Philetus. He told Timothy to “study” that he might be able to “rightly” divide “the word of truth. But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness. And their word will eat as doth as canker. of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus; who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some ” (11 Tim. 2:15-18). False doctrine overthrows the faith of some, so those who are proclaiming it must be exposed.

Paul named Alexander the coppersmith. “Alexander the coppersmith did me much evil. the Lord reward him “cording to his works: Of whom be thou ware also, for he hath greatly withstood our words ” (II Tim. 4:14-15). It is clear that this is not a personality problem, but a doctrinal problem. Alexander had withstood the words and doctrine of Paul. He was an enemy to the truth. Godly pastors face the same problem every day. They stand and proclaim the truth, then their members go home and hear this truth disputed by radio and TV preachers. Often times these false prophets are sending their publications into the homes of members of true churches. Then the man of God is suppose to keep his mouth shut, according to many. Only a coward will be silent when the truth of the Bible is under attack.

John named Diotrephes. “I wrote unto the church; but Diotrephes, who loveth to have the preeminence among them, receiveth us not” (III John 9). He related how this man had prated against him “with malicious words ” (v. 10). He further said, “Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God, but he that doeth evil hath not seen God ” (v. I 1). It is not wrong to name those whose doctrine and practice is contrary to the Word of God.

In fact, the whole Bible abounds in examples of false prophets being named and exposed. All this modem day talk about love, used as an excuse for not exposing error, is not really biblical love but is really sloppy agape.

Moses called the name of Balaam. (See Num. 22-25). Peter exposed “the way of Balaam … who loved the wages of unrighteousness ” (II Pet. 2:15). Balaam was a prophet that was in the work for money, just like some of the TV false prophets today. They beg for money and live like kings, while multitudes of innocent people send them their hard earned money. They are always building colleges, hospitals, TV network satellites, and amusement parks that have a water slide for Jesus. And then we are suppose to keep our mouth shut about these religious charlatans. How can we be silent and be true to God?

Jude exposed “the error of Balaam ” (Jude I 1). John exposed “the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication ” (Rev. 2:14). This gets right to the heart of the matter, concerning the doctrine of separation. Balaam never did curse Israel even though he wanted the wages that he was offered to do so. The men of Israel committed “whoredom with the daughters of Moab … and bowed down to their gods ” (Num. 25:1,2). Why did they do this? Because Balaam taught Balac how to break down the barrier of separation between the Moabites and the Israelites. We know this to be so because it is plainly stated in Rev. 2:14 and Num. 31:16. This sin resulted in 24,000 men of Israel dying under the judgment of God. (Another good example of Christian Rock)

False teachers are breaking down the barrier of separation between God’s people and false religion. There is too little preaching and teaching on the doctrine of separation. Balaam breached the doctrine of personal separation by causing the men of Israel to commit fornication with the Moabite women. He breached the doctrine of ecclesiastical separation by causing the men of Israel to bow down to Baal. This brought a curse upon Israel. Until we get back to teaching the truth about personal and ecclesiastical separation, we can expect the continued widespread havoc that we have today.

It seems to be believed by many that some people are too high and mighty to be named or exposed. Men in high places, pastors of large churches, and those with great radio or TV audiences, are supposedly above criticism. Whatever they may do or say, no matter how contrary to the Bible it may be, is supposedly all right. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Nathan identified the man. There was a man in a very high place who was a secret adulterer. Surely this man who held the highest office in the land could not be rebuked by a lowly unpopular prophet. Nathan went right into the presence of David, revealed the sin in a parable form, and then told the enraged David, “Thou art the man ” (II Sam. 12:7).

Hanani named king Jehoshaphat. In many ways Jehoshaphat was a good king, but he mistakenly forgot to practice religious separation. He caused his son to marry wicked king Ahab’s daughter. (See II Chron. 18: 1; 21:1-6). He made an alliance with Ahab and went to the battle of Ramoth-gilead with him (II Chron. 18). Hanani “said to King Jehoshaphat, Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the Lord? ” (II Chron. 19:2). We have a question for those, “Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the Lord?”

Yes, it is right to expose error and to name those who are in error. It is right to “earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints” (Jude 3). It was once delivered and it has never been recalled for revision. We had better beware of “false teachers … who privily shall bring in damnable heresies ” (II Pet. 2: 1). Faithful messengers will warn the sheep of these heretics, and identify them by name. It is not enough to broadly hint of their identity, for the young lambs will not understand and will be destroyed by the wolves.

Posted in Alan Roxburgh, Allelon, Bob Hunter, Brian McLaren, Charles Christian, Dan Boone, David Pettigrew, Dennis Bratcher, Emergent Church, Emergent church within the Nazarene denomination, Gene Schandorff, Jesse Middendorf, John Hanna, Jon Middendorf, Leonard Sweet, Naz Net, New spirituality, Rick Warren, Rob Bell, Scott Daniels, Shea Zellweger, Tom Oord, Uncategorized | Leave a Comment »

Choices-Setting The Record Straight With The Recent Naz Net Rukus

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on May 13, 2010

Sorry about the long title somethings need to be said here though.
Usually I do not like to address Naz Net stuff here on my blog because its a waste of time.
Even though there are some good and decent people and Christians who comment on Naz Net there comes a time when the truth really needs to come to the top of all the shouting and yelling.
Most people who would actively participate in Naz Net would probably not want to read my blog.
And I appreciate that people have the right to choose what they want to read and information they want to hold on to.
The last point is that Naz Net has banned me from posting (also totally within their rights) so I will need to set the record straight here.
I have been blessed for over the last couple years to be able to be a missionary to the Nazarene denomination a task I willingly took because of some of the wonderful holiness preaching that has been present within the Nazarene denomination.
There are many wonderful good God fearing, Bible believing Christians within the Nazarene denomination.
My task has always been to help expose false teaching and encourage people back toward Gods Holy Word that is captured in scripture inspired by the Holy Spirit and written without error by the various writers of scripture.
The main purpose of Naz Net (in my opinion and observation) seems to be a breading ground for false teaching, explaining awat scripture and a platform to further a liberal and Emergent agenda (meaning the Emergent Church and what it stands for).
Therefore you now have choices.
Which I think is a good thing because it often seperates the sheep from the goats.
There has been a thread recently titled Reformed Nazarenes that has put into question, myself, my dear brother in the Lord Manny Silva as well as the Concerned Nazaarene group.
I would like to thank Naz Net for all the hits to our websites.
It gives people choices.
I would like to clear up a few things though.
I really hesitate talking about him because it gives him press but I need to because he is again just not telling the truth about our group.
I am addressing Bob Hunter.
I have came to think of Bob as almost a cartoon character because as much as he brays some people dont seem to see the inconsistances and the untruths this guy spreads.
Bob’s videos were so outrageous using very little scripture (until I called him out on that one) I actually posted one of his videos side by side with a Concerned Nazarene video on my own blog.
Sometimes its just best to let Bob keep talking.
Again allowing choices.
Keep in mind Bob has stated “I guess that means I traded the car in. I was feeling like it was broke down and I couldn’t be a part of fixing it. To take the analogy further, I know that some are equipped to fix it and should stay behind the wheel…or under the hood. I wanted to stress that not everyone should trade the old beater in like I did, the COTN needs people who can do repair and restore work. I just didn’t feel like I was to be one of them.” end of quote.
So I guess Bob was not satisfied with the fine holiness tradition of the Nazarene denomination and decided that it was in need of change.
At least thats what I get from Bob’s comments.
Bob however no longer attends a Nazarene church but chooses to comment from the outside looking in.
Even though he claims he is still a ordained Nazarene elder.
Thats fine everyone is entitled to their opinion.
But why dont the folks on Naz Net call Bob out on his own lies posted on their website.
Bob stated on Naz Net”And may I remind you all that not unlike myself…these guys are NOT presently in the Nazarene Church! They have left on their own, been asked to leave or never belonged to the CotN in the first place.”
Then Bob stated again on Naz Net “Need I remind you that the key Concerned Nazarene figures are no longer attending Nazarene Churches, they have left, are leaving or never were Nazarenes in the first place!”
Jim Chabot then corrected Bob and stated “You have said this twice now, and you may be correct in most instances I do not know. Manny Silva attends the International Church of the Nazarene in New Bedford, MA, he is comfortable with the teaching here, I personally haven’t heard him object to anything at our church.”
Even after being corrected Bob this minister of misinformation stated
“This group doesn’t even attend a Nazarene Church!” end of quotes
Ok so the one of the actual problems I have with Naz net is that truth and accuracy in statements dont seem to matter to the moderators as long as it forwards their agenda. At least thats my opinion.
Two of the main leaders of the Concerned Nazarene group still attend a Nazarene Church. Both Manny and Bev Turner (a ordained Nazararene elder and evangelist) bith still attend Nazarene churches plus many of the Concerned Nazarene group still attend Nazarene churches. The main reason people are dropping out is because their is no firm word on where the denomination stands on the Emergent heresy that has infiltrated its ranks.
Again you have choices.
Follow the word of this inflated cartoon character who stuggles with telling the truth.
Or believe the actual facts.
Again more choices.
Now I also want to address some staements James Diggs has stated on Naz Net and other places.
James on Naz Net stated “I made some headway with Tim Wirth who finally said that he would accept me as a real Christian and a brother in the Lord, but he has so far not wanted to build on that.”
James also stated “Your good friend Tim Wirth recently retracted his belief that I wasn’t a Christian and now says he accepts me as such.’
Well lets clear this up.( And I also want to say I dont hate anyone not James not Bob but I do not like their actions)
Plus I really pray that James confess’s and rejects the false teachers he has promoted.
Anyway what I actually said to James was this “Yea James if you truly believe as you stated we are brothers in the Lord like it or not : )
That being stated I am estranged from other family members who promote and endorse false teachers.
Even though if you believe as you have stated we are brothers I still stand against much of what you promote and would ask you for Christ’s sake to reject the false Emergent teachers and teach from the scripture.”
I think that James has took some liberties with my statement as well as added some spin of his own.
My statements were contingent that James really believed what he stated and is a saved Christian.
If James is a saved Christian we are brothers, we however are estranged because to the best of my knowledge James has not openly rejected any of the false teachers he has promoted or exposed people and his congregation to.
As far as Manny not addressing Benjamin Burch and his quotes from scripture I would have to say this.
I personally have read many of Benjamins quotes and attempts to explain away scripture on Naz Net.
Why waste time with someone who has shown he cant rightly divide the Word of God?
What would be the point?
Again more choices.
Dont have the time and space to even deal with Dennis Bratcher at this time. If you want to believe Dennis’s spin on scripture and history-well good luck with that one.
Again more choice’s.
As for Dan Boone here are some of Dan Boones quotes from our website-“In an interesting way, we are doing what the Old Testament saints did in moving into Canaan – taking their Canaanite forms and terms and using them in a God-honoring way.”
And another quote“The Hebrew creation account is a re-telling of the Babylonian tale. Their Hebrew feast days are re-interpretations of the Canaanite days. The Royal Psalms in the collection of Psalms were once Canaanite songs.” End of quote.
Wow is all I’ve got to say on that one.
My comments are stated publically and they are.
When can we copy any pagan form and use it in a God honoring way?

Where does the scriptures allow that?

It does not.

Instead here is what God’s Word states:

Deut 18:9-12
9 “When you come into the land which the LORD your God is giving you, you shall not learn to follow the abominations of those nations. 10 There shall not be found among you anyone who makes his son or his daughter pass through the fire, or one who practices witchcraft, or a soothsayer, or one who interprets omens, or a sorcerer, 11or one who conjures spells, or a medium, or a spiritist, or one who calls up the dead.12 For all who do these things are an abomination to the LORD, and because of these abominations the LORD your God drives them out from before you. 13 You shall be blameless before the LORD your God. 14 For these nations which you will dispossess listened to soothsayers and diviners; but as for you, the LORD your God has not appointed such for you.”
Let’s get this straight. God’s Word says that you are not to follow or imitate pagan practices. end quote.
Also I think its a very dangerous place to be to equate the inspiration of the Holy Spirit with demonic inspired influences of a pagan religion.
This has been a long post so lets wrap it up with another Naz Net quote from Hans.
“I think there’s a slight mistake going on here: it’s not you or me who gets to decide what false teaching is, it’s the General Assembly that does that for the Church of the Nazarene. We don’t have popes, you know. And if we need interpretation, we have six guys to do that together, until the GA decides otherwise.”end quote
Wow again.
That statement of course has no basis or root in scripture but is based on man.
You may not have a pope but you may have six if what Hans states is acurate.
Its not up to individuals to decide what false teaching is according to scriptural mandates.
But rather a man or men?
Wow.
More choices.
What about the individual priesthood of all saved believers as stated in 1 Peter 2:9 “But you are not like that, for you are a chosen people. You are royal priests, a holy nation, God’s very own possession. As a result, you can show others the goodness of God, for he called you out of the darkness into his wonderful light.” (see also Heb 10:19-20).
In conclusion as I have said many times there are always choices.
I dont force anyone to read my blog.
I dont have your pet puppy captured forcing you to come outside of your own willingness to see what I have written.
Plus if what we post and write does not add up to scripture I do heartily encourage you to reject it.
If you want to accept the warning we have put out you have that choice.
I would always encourage you to seek your ultimate authority withing the pages of Gods infallable and unchanging Word.
Keep in mind scripture states
2 Thessalonians 2:3a (New King James Version)

3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first
Also Eph 5:11-14
Sincerely in Christ
Tim

PS To any of you who would object to me refering to myself as a missionary to the Nazarene denomination I would state you have two other missionaries that were sent to you-namely Brian McLaren and Len Sweet.
You need to decide who was sent by God and who has been sent by satan.
Again more choices…
PPS-Naz Net Moderators I have proved that Bob Hunter did not tell the truth concerning CN leadership and its Nazarene Church attendence. No call for Bob to retract and repent of his untrue statements.
Ahh more choices

Posted in Bob Hunter, Brian McLaren, Charles Christian, Dan Boone, David Pettigrew, Dennis Bratcher, Emergent Church, Emergent church within the Nazarene denomination, Gene Schandorff, Jesse Middendorf, John Hanna, Jon Middendorf, Leonard Sweet, New spirituality, Rick Warren, Rob Bell, Scott Daniels, Shea Zellweger, Tom Oord, Uncategorized | 2 Comments »

Who Is A Concerned Nazarene or Christian? By Manny Silva

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on May 11, 2010

Good article by my friend and brother in the Lord Manny Silva
Many people who support the emergent church movement seem to be concerned (no pun intended) about numbers, regarding our opposition to their movement. Some of these folks tend to dismiss Concerned Nazarenes as a very small group comprised of “disgruntled” Nazarenes like Manny Silva, or perhaps my friend Tim Wirth, and maybe just a few other friends which perhaps amounts to a small handful of crazies. I think that is a serious mistake if they think so, and perhaps comes from a wish for it to be so.

Often a criticism of emergent opposition is that we have not had enough years of theological training and education, so how can we truly understand biblical doctrine and therefore criticize emergent ideology? One problem with this logic is this: I admit that my best claim to formal theological training is two semesters of New Testament Greek and a few other courses, but what about those who oppose emergent ideology, and who have the equivalent or higher in formal theological education as many emergent pastors have? How does an emergent answer an elder in the Nazarene church who believes as I do, that most of emergent ideology is based on Satan’s game plan of deception, and not rooted in the word of God?

One of the sneakiest game plans that emergent pastors follow, is to not let on that they are emergent! Why is that? Why can’t a pastor or elder who, in private conversation with me perhaps, will admit to supporting all that the EC has to offer; why can’t he also admit that to his congregation? WHy can’t he go on a full fledged campaign to trumpet the virtues of emergent ideology? Why is it that there seems to be a stealth campaign amongst many pastors to hide their true emergent leanings to their flock that they are responsible for feeding the word of God?

I believe the fact of the matter is that, concerned Nazarenes (or Christians) will be totally upfront about what they are for or against, regardless of criticism. But unless a congregation is fully, or almost fully emergent, there is a lack of candor, and a deliberate attempt to hide the full emergent agenda. Unless arm-twisting is done, there will be no statements such as “sure, I’m an emergent pastor, and proud of it. Here is what exactly I support and promote.” And if there is an upfront admission by an emergent pastor, perhaps it’s because they would rather see anyone who is opposed to their ideology, leave so they can more easily and cleanly continue with their agenda, unopposed, in their emergent style church.

I’ve spoken with more and more people who are part of a church which they have discovered has a pastor who is slowly trying to introduce the emergent agenda. They have asked me what they should do, and of course, every situation is different. But I have shared from my experiences and have advised them to work as well as they can to ask questions and get answers. I have warned them that many emergent pastors will respond in a very negative way to questions from members. They could very well be demonized if they stubbornly insist on getting clear answers. They could end up being shunned and eventually will be labelled the troublemakers, trying to divide a church or denomination. The fact is, all they are standing for, unashamedly, is for biblical truth and and the upholding of biblical doctrine, which most emergents think has very little importance now in this post-modern era. (Read 2 Tim. 3:16 to see Paul’s emphasis on doctrine’s importance, among scripture).

Yet I am reminded from a sermon by Pastor Tony a while ago, of this scripture in 1 Peter:

To the elders among you, I appeal as a fellow elder, a witness of Christ’s sufferings and one who also will share in the glory to be revealed: 2Be shepherds of God’s flock that is under your care, serving as overseers—not because you must, but because you are willing, as God wants you to be; not greedy for money, but eager to serve; 3 not lording it over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock. 1 Peter 5:1-3

This tells me that a pastor should not be rebuffing questions from members who are concerned, but should be completely upfront and honest if a concerned member is asking about something. A pastor should not in any way try to demonize someone who has tried to get answers to serious theological inquiries, but instead, give straight and clear answers, and hopefully, answers based on the word of God. A pastor who is responsible (and a very serious responsibility at that) for feeding his flock the whole counsel of God, should do just that! These situations should be teaching moments, not moments of telling a member to go away and stop asking questions? Does that sound vaguely familiar to any of you in your situation? If so, take care and be warned that thing smight not get easy at all, if you question a pastor you think might be emergent.

Finally, another accusation from emergents, which is totally unfounded biblically, is that we should not ever judge, except for the essentials. First of all, what are the essentials anyway? Correct me if wrong, but to me, essentials are whatever we are CLEARLY commanded in the scriptures to do, and not necessarily a short list of our primary doctrinal belief statements. A clear command in scripture is NOT optional. If you disobey in one area, you have disobeyed in all, the scriptures say. And of course, judgmentalism is not something emergents like, but we are commanded over and over again in the scriptures, on how and when to judge, NOT that we should never judge. I don’t have a theology degree, yet I understand that. Why do emergent pastors not understand that? Is it perhaps because when they say, “do not judge”, they deflect from any scrutiny of their doctrine?

So Concerned Nazarenes are not a small fringe group comprised of nutcases such as Manny Silva. There is growing opposition as more pastors, evangelists and other leadership, and plain old laypeople, start finding out about this cancer that has snuck into our universities and churches. Concerned Nazarenes are also totally upfront about their agenda, and are not embarrassed to say it. And, Concerned Nazarenes are judgmental, but as we are commanded in scripture, to “test the spirits”, to discern what is right and wrong doctrine, to know the fruits of those who are false teachers.

As the opposition grows to this “not of God movement”, I am making a plea to any pastor who is opposed to this movement. I ask that you join us clearly in this opposition. I ask that you join those who have risked their pastorates for the sake of truth. I ask that if you truly know that these practices and ideologies being promoted by the emergents is not of God, to speak out against it. It is scriptural, and it is clearly commanded by the Lord, and the apostles, that we do this. We owe it to the young babes in Christ who are still feeding on the milk, but who in their immaturity can be swept away by “almost the truth.”

It would be a big mistake if the emergent crowd continues to believe we are going away. We are not, and we will hold your feet to the fire, as we continue to inform more Nazarenes and Christians of the dangers of this false movement.

Posted in Alan Roxburgh, Allelon, Bob Hunter, Brian McLaren, Charles Christian, Dan Boone, David Pettigrew, Dennis Bratcher, Emergent Church, Emergent church within the Nazarene denomination, Gene Schandorff, Jesse Middendorf, John Hanna, Jon Middendorf, Leonard Sweet, New spirituality, Rick Warren, Rob Bell, Scott Daniels, Tom Oord, Uncategorized | Leave a Comment »

Nazarene Social Justice and It’s Socialist Connections? by exnazarene

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on April 30, 2010

*UPDATE* April 25, 2010 – Apparently, OKC 1st Church of the Nazarene has removed it’s link on their main church website that showed their affiliation with the Industrial Areas Foundation. However, another point of reference with their involvement via their Minister of Social Justice, Lance Schmitz, can be found HERE at a Social Holiness website that claims it operates as a Ministry of Oklahoma First Church of the Nazarene. (I suggest people make copies of these pages before they also disappear.)

In addition, here is another news article that associates Minister of Social Justice, Lance Schmitz, as a committee member of an interfaith community coalition called the Oklahoma Sponsoring Committee, that is directly linked to the Industrial Areas Foundation.

exnazarene, on April 29, 2010 at 3:22 pm Said:
Looks like the links to the Social Holiness website that showed the involvement of Lance Schmitz, Minister of Social Justice, and Oklahoma City First Church of the Nazarene’s involvement with the Industrial Areas Foundation have mysteriously disappeared from the internet.
These things seem to happen once they are exposed publicly.
I hope people made copies of those pages. I did.
OKC 1st seems to have a penchant for disappearing links once they are exposed for what they are. I still remember the Kaleo emergent church website from 2006 (the emergent church operating within OKC 1st church) that had links to all sorts of strange spiritual formation links such as Taize…..and all the less than dignified monikers that graced the names of the ministers involved.
As I recall, Greg Horton was listed as a minister/leader of that group. His moniker was Guy In Monkey Hat, Jon Middendorf’s moniker was Lead Insominac, Steve Green’s moniker was Head Guru.
Yes, after this website was exposed publicly, it also disappeared, but I still have a copy of it.

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http://exnazarene.wordpress.com/2010/01/25/nazarene-social-justice-and-its-communist-connections/

Posted in Bob Hunter, Brian McLaren, Charles Christian, Emergent Church, Emergent church within the Nazarene denomination, Gene Schandorff, Greg Horton, Jesse Middendorf, John Hanna, Jon Middendorf, Leonard Sweet, New spirituality, Rob Bell, Scott Daniels, Shea Zellweger, Tom Oord, Uncategorized | Leave a Comment »

Rob Bell and his weird theology

Posted by nazarenepsalm113 on March 19, 2010

Posted in Alan Roxburgh, Allelon, Bob Hunter, Brian McLaren, Charles Christian, Dan Boone, Dennis Bratcher, Emergent Church, Emergent church within the Nazarene denomination, Jesse Middendorf, John Hanna, Jon Middendorf, Leonard Sweet, New spirituality, Rick Warren, Rob Bell, Scott Daniels, Tom Oord, Uncategorized | Leave a Comment »